Nidzilla 2k

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Draaen
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Nidzilla 2k

Postby Draaen » Tue Dec 03, 2019 4:23 pm

2020 will be the year I start seriously focusing on my Nidzilla list. So after seeing the points changes and some of the new rules I have come up with a list that I think would be a good core to start experimenting with. I am not really interested in the little gribblies at all. I would like my troops to be either warriors or ripper swarms and I think a dual battalion is important.

Custom Hive Fleet
Trait 1 - All monsters get +1 to hit in the first round of combat
Trait 2 - Every unit regenerates 1 wound at the start of the round

HQ:
Old One Eye
Neurothrope
2 X Hive Tyrant - Venom Cannon, 2 Death Spitters

Troops
6 x 3 Ripper Swarms

The Monsters
2 x Maleceptor
2 x Toxicrene - 5++ Invul doubles wound total for degredation (Costs 2 CP Total)
2 x Haruspex - 5++ Invul doubles wound total for degredation (Costs 2 CP Total)
4 x Carnifex with 2 monstrous Scything Talons, Adrenal Glands, Spine Banks and Bone Mace
1 X Mawloc

General Strategy is to let the dakka tyrants, rippers and neurothrope hold midfield and backfield objectives while still being useful or cheap as chips. The main damage needs to come from the big bugs up front. The Maleceptor can give all shooting against my bugs a small nexus -1 to strength. This should make them almost immune to small arms fire forcing bolters to wound on a 6. The Maleceptor has a 4++ so while he makes himself a target he also is somewhat durable. While I could not hide him from everything I might be able to limit enough to allow him to survive a round. Toxicrene can hold a unit in combat with a stratagem and the haruspex actually can heal 3 wounds a turn between it's attacks and the trait. Both hit on 3's in the first turn of combat. So I will need to make sure the monsters support each other as they move up the board. Carnifex are for bulk and are built super cheaply at about 90 points a model. If they die they die but realistically there will be a lot of other bigger targets to clear off. However on the charge those dudes are getting 5 Strength 6 AP-3 3 Damage attacks that hit on 2's re-rolling 1's to hit plus a S8 AP-1 D3 damage shot. So they generate good volume of attacks. Mawlock is in there cause I have one and they can contest an objective or threaten things like mortar squads while still providing bulk.

Of note old one eye is nuts. He generates extra attacks on a 3+ with his scything talons and 4+ with his crushing claws and heals 2 wounds a turn while benefiting from character protections.

Flyers will be an issue along with infantry saying lol nope and climbing onto buildings. I do have a lot of psychic so I was thinking I may have enough mortal wounds to force them out or I could take some brood lords and shuffle my monsters around a bit so that they could just happily hide amongst the carnifexen before they jump out and charge up the ruins. Most of my guys have at least some shooting, albeit not great, so that may help out the cause too.

I am also making an assumption that the reviewers are making an error and that I can adapt more then 2 monsters. When they read out the stratagem I didn't hear it limited to one use only. But it is a pregame stratagem which you can repeat unlike in game ones. If that were to change I may have to rethink the Haruspex and Toxicrene bros.

So that is the general scheme so far. Probably what I end up will look a lot different but this seems to get out a lot of bulk. Just not sure it will have the durability and early damage output to compete well. That is 14 monsters though which is cool to me! I really want that Maleceptor to work well cause they in the lists regardless. Something about the big brain rhino bug I find really cool.
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I'm happy to play lower points levels with people who are staring out or building up new forces
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Connman234
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Re: Nidzilla 2k

Postby Connman234 » Tue Dec 03, 2019 11:58 pm

Goonhammer is a fantastic website that I think you should reference. They have an article with all the Blood of Baal Tyranid stuff with verbatim rules. The max you can have for adaptive traits is 2 models (1 free for giving up warlord trait, another for 1 CP).

From what I can gauge, your list has a big big problem of dealing with screens.. Flying Hive Tyrants with 2 sets of 2 devourers are super nasty and cleans up that problem there (24 shots at S4 AP-0 1D per flyrant). You can also do the same thing with carnifexes. Once you get into melee, you definitely have strength to punch vehicles, but you might want to invest in some more ranged shooting. Hive Guard are probably the best shooting unit for Tyranids. Impaler Cannons are Heavy 2, S8 AP-2 D3D that takes away cover and no LOS needed. A tyrannofex with a rupture cannon can even help.

From what I counted (note, this doesn't include points changes from CA 2019), your list is over 2k.

In terms of traits, I can very much see the traits you picked and they do work well with your big monsters. The big problem with the new Tyranid custom hive fleet, is that there is no base chapter to work off of (I.E. you can't evolve from a Kraken hive fleet). This may be FAQ'd, but I actually feel that Kraken would help your list more. If you are not surrounded/kidnapped with your big bugs, Kraken allows you to fall back and charge, but also unlocks a way to pretty much turn any thing into a missile (hopefully if you get one psychic power off.

Here is an interesting list that I made that I think you would like that fits your theme (with current points), but some "smaller" bugs. Still double batallion.

HQ
Swarmlord
Hive Tyrant (Flying, 2 Twin Devourers)
Neurothrope
Old One Eye

Troops
5x 3 Ripper Swarms
1x 8 Tyranid Warriors with Boneswords, Rending Claws, and Adrenal Glands

Other Big Bugs
Haruspex
Maleceptor
3x 1 Carnifex 2x Monstrous Scything Talons, Adrenal Glands, Toxin Sacs, and Tusks
Trygon with Biostatic Rattle
Tyrannocyte

The italicized items are the "interesting" part of this list.

You put the Trygon in reserve with the warriors and the Haruspex in the Tyrannocyte also in reserve. March up rest of your units while rippers cap objectives/board control. Swarmlord can propel himself, or another model in the shooting phase. The model you really want to move, try to advance him and get Onslaught off (WC6). So now this big bug can Move, Advance, Move, Advance, Charge. T2, the warriors and haruspex comes in. You can't fling these units with the Swarmlord, but you can fling another unit. The warriors out of the trygon will need an 8" charge thanks to adrenal glands, and put out 32 Space Marine Punches at AP-2. Haruspex comes in and eats. By this point, the rest of your big bugs hopefully have survived the march and are ready to consume biomass.

Either way, those are my thoughts. Feel free to tell me wrongly. :)
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Draaen
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Re: Nidzilla 2k

Postby Draaen » Wed Dec 04, 2019 8:00 am

Connman234 wrote:
Tue Dec 03, 2019 11:58 pm
From what I can gauge, your list has a big big problem of dealing with screens.

From what I counted (note, this doesn't include points changes from CA 2019), your list is over 2k.

HQ
Swarmlord
Hive Tyrant (Flying, 2 Twin Devourers)
Neurothrope
Old One Eye

Troops
5x 3 Ripper Swarms
1x 8 Tyranid Warriors with Boneswords, Rending Claws, and Adrenal Glands

Other Big Bugs
Haruspex
Maleceptor
3x 1 Carnifex 2x Monstrous Scything Talons, Adrenal Glands, Toxin Sacs, and Tusks
Trygon with Biostatic Rattle
Tyrannocyte

The italicized items are the "interesting" part of this list.

You put the Trygon in reserve with the warriors and the Haruspex in the Tyrannocyte also in reserve. March up rest of your units while rippers cap objectives/board control. Swarmlord can propel himself, or another model in the shooting phase. The model you really want to move, try to advance him and get Onslaught off (WC6). So now this big bug can Move, Advance, Move, Advance, Charge. T2, the warriors and haruspex comes in. You can't fling these units with the Swarmlord, but you can fling another unit. The warriors out of the trygon will need an 8" charge thanks to adrenal glands, and put out 32 Space Marine Punches at AP-2. Haruspex comes in and eats. By this point, the rest of your big bugs hopefully have survived the march and are ready to consume biomass.

Either way, those are my thoughts. Feel free to tell me wrongly. :)
So the warriors, Haruspex, Trygon Scything Talons and Exocrine went down in points. Sadly the Maleceptor stayed the same but warriors did go down a couple of points.1

I took another look and yeah definitely only two guys can have the physiology upgrade so I'll really have to put in some thought into what physiology on which monster gives me the most bang for my buck.

I like the list you made a lot. I definitely like the idea of the trygon bringing in the warriors. I want to fit them into the list but I kind of feel they will get their clocks cleaned unless I really commit to them. Is there any reason you equipped the warriors with rending claws instead of the cheaper scything talons or spinefists? I could see value in actually going boneswords and deathspitters at a small increase thanks CA points drop and doing the fire twice strat. 48 heavy bolter shots could help clear chaff followed up by ideally 24 baby bone swords would potentially be enough of a return for a unit that will likely die the turn they show up.

I get that the swarmlord is awesome but he is also a bucket load of points. In my mind the question with him is whether the ability to get a first turn charge off with 1 big bug is worth 1-1.5 other big bugs. I suppose flinging a toxicrene in turn 1 and popping the no fall back strat would be really cool. Even with the speedy white scars though I find I want to land my charges around the same time as the nail that sticks out tends to get knocked down. Which may be useful to keep the maleceptor bubble up... Yep I am conflicted lol.

Hive fleet though I think is controversial for me. Kraken is nice to fall back and assault but even with my white scars I don't end up using it a ton. But my carnifexes could hit on 2's the turn they charge so maybe I will just crush whatever I run into and then won't need to fall back? My tau and white scars are sort of fall back specialists as well and I want something a bit different. Since I am moving so many big bodies across the board and I can't swarm it with little gribblies I think I need to plan on a turn 2 charge which is probably doable with a turn 1 advance and a turn 2 move and assault by the melee bugs. I plan on ditching warlord trait for the physiology so I lose the psychic power and the strat which is big but for my list +1 to hit in the first round of combat brings me from hitting on 4's to 3's. I can even equip crushing claws on the carnifexes and hit on 3's or 2's with old one eye. That would certainly help out the anti-tank department.

I'll let it percolate a bit. A cool thing about tyranids is the sheer variety of models. There are definitely a couple viable routes I could move down.
Game Preferences:
Current Beta rules in effect
I'm happy to play lower points levels with people who are staring out or building up new forces
Fair warning my doofy daemons have 3rd party models, scratch builds, old warhammer models and I haven't moved all their bases over to the 40k ones yet! Happy to switch to either Tau or White Scars.
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Connman234
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Joined: Wed Dec 14, 2016 1:41 pm
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Re: Nidzilla 2k

Postby Connman234 » Wed Dec 04, 2019 10:03 am

I can see this also working with your custom give fleets too. I just like kraken and the "guarantee" of the charge kraken gives. Now, if you can pick a parent give fleet, then that changes drastically and gives you more freedom in stratagems.

I went with rending claws based on my luck with genestealers. Sadly, I didn't have points to give them toxin sacs, but 6's to wound are AP-4 can come in really handy (2D with toxin sacs). Scything talons do give you a hit re-roll, but to get an extra attack, they would need two pairs. I feel as though you want to do more melee, so I feel rending claws would work better.

The swarmlord is a lot of points don't get me wrong, but he is also an absolute beat stick.Top bracket, he is 6 attacks at S7 AP-3 3D with 6's to wound doing an additional mortal, and a tail swing that is AP0 D3D. He can fling himself, so he goes "SUP!!!" And goes into any scary character or vehicle.

With the carnifexes, have you also thought about screamer-killers? They almost have the same load out, but gives a -1 morale to enemies. You can get them close and with morale shinanigans, hopefully kill more guys.

Again, more food for thought.
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