Tau vs Iron Hands 2K LVO Prep

Played a game? Post your battle reports here for discussion!
User avatar
Draaen
Member
Posts: 500
Joined: Sun Mar 26, 2017 4:02 pm
Name: Mark
Experience Level: Advanced
Play Style: Casual+Competitive
Armies: Tau, White Scars, Tyranids (Nidzilla)

Tau vs Iron Hands 2K LVO Prep

Postby Draaen » Mon Jan 20, 2020 12:14 am

So Spencer requested I play Richard Spieglers Tau list for some LVO preparation. Of note this Triptide list is the anti-thesis of my usual play style so I tried to bone up on it before the game.

I promised to do a fairly unfiltered analysis of the game which would hopefully help him out. So my comments may be harsher in tone towards myself or Spencer in this write up then I would typically do.

Iron Hands

++ Vanguard Detachment +1CP (Imperium - Space Marines) [64 PL, , 1,121pts] ++

+ No Force Org Slot [1CP] +

**Chapter Selection**: Iron Hands

Detachment CP [1CP]

+ HQ [11 PL, -1CP, 167pts] +

Chaplain Venerable Dreadnought [11 PL, -1CP, 167pts]: 5. Recitation of Focus, Litany of Hate, Stratagem: Paragon of Iron [-1CP], Student of History, The Imperium's Sword, Twin lascannon [40pts], Warlord
. Melee weapon [22pts]: Dreadnought combat weapon [20pts], Storm bolter [2pts]

+ Elites [40 PL, 698pts] +

Ironclad Dreadnought [7 PL, 145pts]: 2x Hunter-killer missile [12pts], Ironclad Assault Launchers [5pts], Meltagun [14pts], Seismic hammer [30pts]
. Dreadnought combat weapon w/Heavy Flamer [14pts]: Heavy flamer [14pts]

Redemptor Dreadnought [7 PL, 153pts]: 2x Storm Bolters [4pts], Heavy flamer [14pts], Heavy Onslaught Gatling Cannon [30pts]

Relic Sicaran Punisher Assault Tank [14 PL, 185pts]: Heavy bolter [10pts]
. Two heavy bolters [20pts]: 2x Heavy bolter [20pts]

Relic Whirlwind Scorpius [12 PL, 215pts]: Scorpius multi-launcher [40pts]

+ Heavy Support [13 PL, 256pts] +

Contemptor Mortis Dreadnought [9 PL, 164pts]: Cyclone missile launcher [32pts]
. Two multi-meltas [44pts]: 2x Multi-melta [44pts]

Thunderfire Cannon [4 PL, 92pts]
. Techmarine Gunner [37pts]
. . Servo-harness [11pts]: Flamer [6pts], Plasma cutter [5pts]

++ Battalion Detachment +5CP (Imperium - Space Marines) [26 PL, 6CP, 425pts] ++

+ No Force Org Slot [6CP] +

**Chapter Selection**: Iron Hands

Battle-forged CP [3CP]

Detachment CP [5CP]

Relics of the Chapter [-2CP]: 2x Number of extra Relics [-2CP]

+ HQ [11 PL, 170pts] +

Iron Father Feirros [6 PL, 110pts]

Lieutenants [5 PL, 60pts]
. Lieutenant [5 PL, 60pts]: Bolt pistol, Chainsword, The Tempered Helm

+ Troops [15 PL, 255pts] +

Intercessor Squad [5 PL, 85pts]: Stalker Bolt Rifle
. 4x Intercessor [68pts]
. Intercessor Sergeant [17pts]

Intercessor Squad [5 PL, 85pts]: Stalker Bolt Rifle
. 4x Intercessor [68pts]
. Intercessor Sergeant [17pts]

Intercessor Squad [5 PL, 85pts]: Stalker Bolt Rifle
. 4x Intercessor [68pts]
. Intercessor Sergeant [17pts]

++ Battalion Detachment +5CP (Imperium - Space Marines) [23 PL, 2CP, 453pts] ++

+ No Force Org Slot [5CP] +

**Chapter Selection**: Iron Hands

Detachment CP [5CP]

+ HQ [11 PL, -3CP, 198pts] +

Chaplain [5 PL, -2CP, 90pts]: 3. Exhortation of Rage, 4. Mantra of Strength, Benediction of Fury, Bolt pistol, Jump Pack [1 PL, 18pts], Litany of Hate, Stratagem: Hero of the Chapter [-1CP], Strategem: Master of Sanctity [-1CP], Wise Orator

Librarian in Terminator Armor [6 PL, -1CP, 108pts]: 1) Blessing of the Machine God, 4) Psysteel Armor, 5) Reforge, Force stave [8pts], Stratagem: Chief Librarian [-1CP], The Ironstone

+ Troops [12 PL, 255pts] +

Tactical Squad [4 PL, 85pts]
. 3x Space Marine [36pts]
. Space Marine Sergeant [12pts]
. . Boltgun/Bolt pistol
. Space Marine w/Heavy Weapon [37pts]: Lascannon [25pts]

Tactical Squad [4 PL, 85pts]
. 3x Space Marine [36pts]
. Space Marine Sergeant [12pts]
. . Boltgun/Bolt pistol
. Space Marine w/Heavy Weapon [37pts]: Lascannon [25pts]

Tactical Squad [4 PL, 85pts]
. 3x Space Marine [36pts]
. Space Marine Sergeant [12pts]
. . Boltgun/Bolt pistol
. Space Marine w/Heavy Weapon [37pts]: Lascannon [25pts]

++ Total: [113 PL, 8CP, 1,999pts] ++



Tau

+++ Richard’s Atlanta Open List – 10 CP, 2,000 pts +++

Battalion Detachment (393 pts, +5 CP)
T’au Sept

HQ: Commander in XV85 Enforcer Battlesuit w/Advanced Targeting System, 3x Cyclic Ion Blaster, 2x MV4 Shield Drone
HQ: Ethereal w/Honour Blade, Hover drone, 2x MV4 Shield Drone

Troops: Breacher Team (x5) 2x MV4 Shield Drone
Troops: Breacher Team (x5) w/Guardian Drone, Shield Drone
Troops: Breacher Team (x5) w/Guardian Drone, Shield Drone

Outrider Detachment (617 pts, +1 CP)
T’au Sept

HQ: Commander in XV86 Coldstar Battlesuit w/Drone Controller, 3x Fusion blaster, 2x MV4 Shield Drone

FA: Pathfinder Team (x5) w/MV31 Pulse Accelerator Drone, MV33 Grav-Inhibitor Drone, MB3 Recon Drone, 2x MV4 Shield Drone
FA: Tactical Drones – 8x MV4 Shield Drone, 4x MV7 Marker Drone
FA: Tactical Drones – 8x MV4 Shield Drone, 4x MV7 Marker Drone
FA: Tactical Drones – 8x MV4 Shield Drone, 4x MV7 Marker Drone

Vanguard Detachment (990 pts, +1 CP)
T’au Sept

HQ: Commander in XV85 Enforcer Battlesuit w/Advanced Targeting System, 3x Cyclic Ion Blaster, 2x MV4 Shield Drone, Warlord

EL: XV104 Riptide Battlesuit w/2x Smart Missile System, Advanced targeting System, heavy burst cannon, velocity tracker
EL: XV104 Riptide Battlesuit w/2x Smart Missile System, Advanced targeting System, heavy burst cannon, velocity tracker
EL: XV104 Riptide Battlesuit w/2x Smart Missile System, Advanced targeting System, heavy burst cannon, velocity tracker


Pregame Assessment:
So just looking at the lists I realize my riptides lost the +1 to hit vs flyers or ignore movement penalties gamble as the iron hands have no flyers. The Sicarian with 27 shots is a big threat to my shield drones. His durability is frankly bonkers for this list to deal with. Reducing damage by one and halving damage on dreads with lots of big vehicles and some great long range artillery which doesn't require line of sight will be hard to deal with.

Triptide is not a fancy flashy army so I will really just have to get back to shooting castle basics. Hide turn 1 and turn 2. great target priority and kill a target the turn I shoot at it. Keep the game close turns 1 and 2 then score my points turn 3+ when the critical targets AKA sicarian and redemptor are dead.

Deployment:
Empty map. Standard L. Bonus point is if you get 3 characters on 3 different objectives.
Image

Spencer wins first turn and is probably going first.

The two line of sight blockers hold in a corner. Melee dreads on his flanks with ranged dreads in the center. Sicarian more towards the center. Infantry spread out. Overall I liked the deployment. He can't realistically get the 3 characters on an objective T1 and it's a nice set up for later turns. The one mistake I saw is the iron stone is too far away from the sicarian. That and the redemptor are my two I need to kill this target. If the sicarian and the redemptor through the ironstone or the dread strategy could reduce incoming riptide damage to 1 that would be almost impossible for this list to kill.
Image

My Deployment:
As I said this list is not my style. The micromanagement was a nightmare! But every one of those little models on the ruin is a drone and almost all on the first floor.

So I looked at ranges and I had three goals. Make him move the forgeworld mortar, hide the drones and get him to move the sicarian to the center so my riptides could kill it. The thought was the melee threat would have a hard time getting to me and by the time it did I could divert the resources comfortably. I chose to deep strike my two ion commanders. They would not have been in range of anything unless I exposed my drones.

So if I kill a Sicarian lose some inconsequential drones my deployment works out well.
Image

Iron Hands Turn 1:
The whole army moves up drones begin to die and he gets first blood. Importantly Sicarian is in riptide range and holding his second objective. He kills a lot of fire warriors as well which is nice. I paid 2 valuable CP to get my guys cover and that ended up being a huge waste of CP. I had visions of him shooting heavy bolters at my riptides and them just tanking it. Spencer did not take my bait and removed the proper targets. Either way I am happy with the damage sustained turn 1. All according to plan
Image

Tau Turn 1: AKA where it no longer goes according to plan
My whole army stays still. Knowing I need to kill the sicarian I declare Kauyon and put everything into it. Now here I should have pulled oodles of levers like the +1 to wound stratagem and not getting a 3++ save on the riptides. I thought I could be more conservative and I failed to kill the sicarian. No first blood, no kill one, no hold more since it stayed on the objective. This was a disastrous start mainly due to a piloting error. I do believe that sicarian dies piloted by someone better since it did not have the iron stone damage reduction.

Image

Iron Hands Turn 2:
Sicarian hides in the L. The army in general moves forward. Shooting sees drones die. The Tau are weathering the fire rather well. Spencer is really just taking up all the space I ceded to him to set him up in the later turns. I do have my commanders coming in next turn but I do think being a bit more passive and hiding the redemptor is not necessarily a bad play. It is a good distraction carnifex at this point too so it is not a bad decision. I was nervous about moving out since I could not declare Mont'ka and my drones would need to expose themselves.

Image

Tau Turn 2:
Both commanders deep strike into the back left lining up the the chaplain. Cold star commander moves forward lining up the redemptor. Shooting sees the a tactical squad and the chaplain die. The redemptor unfortunately lives. Thanks to the magic of magic boxes the commanders shield drones will hopefully stop the ion commaders from dying. Iron hands hold more and kill more so I fall further behind. At this point though I still have all my damage dealing assets though I am not out of this game. Just way further behind then I want to be. I have not killed a single of my high priority targets which was one of my two keys to winning the game.

Image

Iron Hands Turn 3:
The redemptor moves towards the fusion cold star. The rest of the army moves forward and is hoping to get some shots on my one cammander. Long story short more drones die but not the ones below the ion commanders so they are protected. The cold star is smushed in combat by the redemptor. I'm pretty sure he gets 3 characters on 3 objectives or he can get it next turn. I do think the Iron Hands could have been a bit more aggressive pressuring the ion commanders. That is a big return if you can kill them. Stepping out to kill the cold star was entirely correct. I gambled on killing the redemptor and lost but the cold star is so fast if you don't kill him when you have the chance he will be a PITA

Image

Tau Turn 3:
ion commanders hop back on top of the magic box to shoot again. The castle *Shockingly* stays in place. Shooting sees the redemptor and the Sicaran finally die. Miscellaneous damage goes out to the rest. Again Spencer gets kill more and hold more. I think he got a bonus point too

Pretty sure I decided against this. Thought was to maybe trap the Sicaran.
Image

Iron Hands Turn 4:
Spencer consolidates on the three objectives. He definitely has the bonus point this round. Shooting sees more drones die, the 2 commanders drones die and one of the remaining commanders die.

Image

Tau Turn 4:
I stay put again. I probably should have moved out here tbh. I manage to kill his two dreads in the center damage the last heavy dread and the anti-infantry firepower has really made a huge dent. I am winning the war of attrition. I think I may have gotten kill more but he got hold more and the bonus point

Image

Iron Hands Turn 5:
Dread goes to kill the last commander and he moves some infantry across the board for line breaker. We both want objectives at the end of the game so he looks to claim as many as possible next turn. More drones die and he does finally kill the last commander.

Image

Tau Turn 5
We finally move! Riptides move to hopefully claim objectives next turn. I kill more infantry.

No Pic

Iron Hands Turn 6:
Dread moves onto the left flank objective and his units get in place. as a shock to no one more drones die.

No Pic

Tau Turn 6:
Riptides move onto 3 objectives kill oodles of targets and I manage to hold 3 objectives and contest the center objective.

Image

Result:
Resounding Tau Loss. There was a good push at the end but that was too little too late.

Having had some time to think about this game there are a couple of things which came to mind. Killing the drones was nice for kill more but ultimately pointless. Killing my other support or what needed to kill the commanders was the best use of the iron hands resources. Alternatively playing more standoffish maybe even pulling back to the two objectives would have been a good method. Las cannon pot shots indirect fire kills drones for kill one. Since my range is 36" with the heavy burst cannon I'd have had to move forward with all my drones. Then you would have had an actual shot at killing the drones and riptides and my commanders cannot contribute except in a suicidal manner.

The Iron Hands army is scary and hard to kill. A more seasoned trip tide player would play this differently and could get good results. If the Sicaran died in turn 1, as I believe is probable without the iron stone buff, the redemptor is probably killed turn 2 and the army can begin to move out and protect the commanders. If that were to happen the Iron hands would probably have a much tougher game and I think would be at a disadvantage. Further the sicarans ability to take out exposed drones was buts and it was voluntarily moved into a firing squad turn 1. Even without the Iron stone had the tank moved to a position where only one riptide could get to or make it so that all three riptides had to move more to the left flank that would have been a better use. I do think the Sicarian opening was an error I failed to capitalize on. There was no need to expose him to so much return fire for a couple fire warriors.

Further I do believe some thought should be put into the end of the game. I had firmly lost the game turn 6 but I really just looked to get more points and deny you points. Was it possible to better move some units or models to stop me from denying those points?

Either way it was an interesting game and a fun exercise. I think I will leave the triptide lists to other players as it was very strong and durable just not my style.

Hope this helps Spence. Good luck at the LVO!
Game Preferences:
Current Beta rules in effect
I'm happy to play lower points levels with people who are staring out or building up new forces
User avatar
Connman234
Officer
Posts: 811
Joined: Wed Dec 14, 2016 1:41 pm
Name: Spencer Connell
Experience Level: Intermediate
Play Style: Casual+Competitive
Armies: Marines, Ad-Mech, Zerkers, Necrons, Nids
Location: Wakefield, MA

Re: Tau vs Iron Hands 2K LVO Prep

Postby Connman234 » Mon Jan 20, 2020 10:33 am

Thank you for the write up man! It definitely was a fun and interesting game. At this point, I've done all the prep I can do. The army is packed up and ready for flight. Time to see how I do at the LVO!
"Let Justice be Done. Though the Heavens Fall"

Image
User avatar
Wynce
Posts: 135
Joined: Sun May 12, 2019 6:34 pm
Name: Dan McDonough
Experience Level: Experienced
Play Style: Casual+Competitive
Armies: Marines, Tau, Guard
Location: Burlington MA

Re: Tau vs Iron Hands 2K LVO Prep

Postby Wynce » Mon Jan 20, 2020 2:05 pm

Connman234 wrote:
Mon Jan 20, 2020 10:33 am
Thank you for the write up man! It definitely was a fun and interesting game. At this point, I've done all the prep I can do. The army is packed up and ready for flight. Time to see how I do at the LVO!
what was the final list you went with?
Salamanders and Space Wolves
User avatar
Connman234
Officer
Posts: 811
Joined: Wed Dec 14, 2016 1:41 pm
Name: Spencer Connell
Experience Level: Intermediate
Play Style: Casual+Competitive
Armies: Marines, Ad-Mech, Zerkers, Necrons, Nids
Location: Wakefield, MA

Re: Tau vs Iron Hands 2K LVO Prep

Postby Connman234 » Mon Jan 20, 2020 2:52 pm

Final LVO List

++ Vanguard Detachment +1CP (Imperium - Space Marines) [64 PL, 1CP, 1,135pts] ++

+ No Force Org Slot [1CP] +

**Chapter Selection**: Iron Hands

Detachment CP [1CP]

+ HQ [11 PL, 179pts] +

Chaplain Venerable Dreadnought [11 PL, 179pts]: Litany of Hate, Twin lascannon [40pts], Warlord

. Melee weapon [34pts]: Dreadnought combat weapon [20pts], Heavy flamer [14pts]

+ Elites [40 PL, 700pts] +

Ironclad Dreadnought [7 PL, 145pts]: Meltagun [14pts], 2x Hunter-killer missile [12pts], Ironclad Assault Launchers [5pts], Seismic hammer [30pts]

. Dreadnought combat weapon w/Heavy Flamer [14pts]: Heavy flamer [14pts]

Redemptor Dreadnought [7 PL, 155pts]: 2x Storm Bolters [4pts], Heavy Onslaught Gatling Cannon [30pts], Onslaught Gatling Cannon [16pts]

Relic Sicaran Punisher Assault Tank [14 PL, 185pts]: Heavy bolter [10pts]

. Two heavy bolters [20pts]: 2x Heavy bolter [20pts]

Relic Whirlwind Scorpius [12 PL, 215pts]: Scorpius multi-launcher [40pts]

+ Heavy Support [13 PL, 256pts] +

Contemptor Mortis Dreadnought [9 PL, 164pts]: Cyclone missile launcher [32pts]

. Two multi-meltas [44pts]: 2x Multi-melta [44pts]

Thunderfire Cannon [4 PL, 92pts]

. Techmarine Gunner [37pts]

. . Servo-harness [11pts]: Flamer [6pts], Plasma cutter [5pts]

++ Battalion Detachment +5CP (Imperium - Space Marines) [26 PL, 8CP, 425pts] ++

+ No Force Org Slot [8CP] +

**Chapter Selection**: Iron Hands

Battle-forged CP [3CP]

Detachment CP [5CP]

+ HQ [11 PL, 170pts] +

Iron Father Feirros [6 PL, 110pts]

Lieutenants [5 PL, 60pts]

. Lieutenant [5 PL, 60pts]: Bolt pistol, Chainsword, The Tempered Helm

+ Troops [15 PL, 255pts] +

Intercessor Squad [5 PL, 85pts]: Stalker Bolt Rifle

. 4x Intercessor [68pts]

. Intercessor Sergeant [17pts]

Intercessor Squad [5 PL, 85pts]: Stalker Bolt Rifle

. 4x Intercessor [68pts]

. Intercessor Sergeant [17pts]

Intercessor Squad [5 PL, 85pts]: Stalker Bolt Rifle

. 4x Intercessor [68pts]

. Intercessor Sergeant [17pts]

++ Battalion Detachment +5CP (Imperium - Space Marines) [23 PL, 5CP, 440pts] ++

+ No Force Org Slot [5CP] +

**Chapter Selection**: Iron Hands

Detachment CP [5CP]

+ HQ [11 PL, 200pts] +

Chaplain [5 PL, 90pts]: Bolt pistol, Jump Pack [1 PL, 18pts], Litany of Hate

Librarian in Terminator Armor [6 PL, 110pts]: Force stave [8pts], Storm bolter [2pts]

+ Troops [12 PL, 240pts] +

Tactical Squad [4 PL, 85pts]

. 3x Space Marine [36pts]

. Space Marine Sergeant [12pts]

. . Boltgun/Bolt pistol

. Space Marine w/Heavy Weapon [37pts]: Lascannon [25pts]

Tactical Squad [4 PL, 85pts]

. 3x Space Marine [36pts]

. Space Marine Sergeant [12pts]

. . Boltgun/Bolt pistol

. Space Marine w/Heavy Weapon [37pts]: Lascannon [25pts]

Tactical Squad [4 PL, 70pts]

. 3x Space Marine [36pts]

. Space Marine Sergeant [12pts]

. . Boltgun/Bolt pistol

. Space Marine w/Heavy Weapon [22pts]: Heavy bolter [10pts]

++ Total: [113 PL, 14CP, 2,000pts] ++

Created with BattleScribe (https://battlescribe.net)

Pretty much, my gut feeling, is that I will be charged on early and hard via centurions, Sanguinary Guard, etc. Run M.o.S. Chaplain with Wise Orator, and chaplain dread with melee buffs. Mantra of Strength and Imperium's Sword Warlord Trait makes him an extra scary bouncer unit, that is durable, and with literally getting into melee, he can punch a knight for 6 attacks wounding on 2+

Sicaran and Redemptor Dread act a disctraction, but has enough dakka to deal with screens and MSU. My games against Mark and JP have proven that.

Tacticals make a surprise appearance for some. They have some of my anti-tank weaponry due to having lascannons and a heavy bolter (STUPID CHAPLAIN DREAD HAVING A FLAMER!!!). The contemptor mortis is also the same plan of anti-tank. Multi-meltas because of what I have, but it is a duable, distraction unity too.

Ironclad dreadnaught is a "surprise" bouncer unit if I am charged. He has a fist to not suffer hit penalties in melee, but the seismic hammer... That is my "what just happened" unit. it's a -1H Sx2 AP-4 5D hammer. Great if centurions get to me, and with full counter-buff plan, it's re-rolling the hit rolls.

Thunderfire and Whirlwhind Scorpius are "standard" good units. The whirlwhind may not be for just Primaris Units, but the combination of the two are they "I WILL GET YOU OFF AN OBJECTIVE" units.
"Let Justice be Done. Though the Heavens Fall"

Image
User avatar
Connman234
Officer
Posts: 811
Joined: Wed Dec 14, 2016 1:41 pm
Name: Spencer Connell
Experience Level: Intermediate
Play Style: Casual+Competitive
Armies: Marines, Ad-Mech, Zerkers, Necrons, Nids
Location: Wakefield, MA

Re: Tau vs Iron Hands 2K LVO Prep

Postby Connman234 » Tue Jan 21, 2020 8:59 pm

Fishwater wrote:
Tue Jan 21, 2020 8:19 pm
Did you get your Chaplain Dread okay'ed by the LVO guys?
I did not, but it is the official model. So I am not worried about it.
"Let Justice be Done. Though the Heavens Fall"

Image